Warning: If that title wasn’t fair enough warning for you, please be assured that there will be heavily spoilerish discussion of the end of The Dark Knight Rises. Don’t want it spoiled? Don’t read on.
With The Dark Knight Rises now having spent its first two days in cinemas across the globe, and the expected hyperbole-laden reviews intermingled with some surprisingly unimpressed ones, it seems that not everyone was universally enchanted by Christopher Nolan’s trilogy-ender.
For my own part I was impressed with Nolan’s commitment to spectacle, and by a lot of his sequences, but there is no way I could bring myself to laud it with a flawless review – it was certainly good, and jaw-droppingly so at certain points, but something about the lack of finesse in some of the technical aspects (most notably the editing) and in how the story unfolded made Rises feel slightly undercooked.
But more specifically than that, on reflection the ending left something to be desired. At this stage I’m not talking about the debate regarding Bruce Wayne’s death and whether or not the scene in which Alfred saw Bruce Wayne alive and well was a dream sequence (it wasn’t) – I refer instead to what resolution the Rises script afforded its protagonist.
Now, people are saying that the end was the perfect and fitting cap on Nolan’s trilogy, offering a semi-definite way out for Bruce Wayne and enough space for the progression of the franchise on the same time-line thanks to the symbolic torch-passing during the final sequence, but I struggle to see how Bruce Wayne walking away from being Batman is a fitting end considering his beginning.
The idea that Wayne would be gripped by the all-encompassing urge to “start again” away from Gotham and his duties of protection, simply because he isn’t the only one who could do the job is a fairly major disservice to the character. Of course it is well within Nolan’s right as a film-maker to change the story, and the overcoming of his obsession with being Batman represents a conventional story progression (from cause to resolution), but Batman’s origin is a pillar of the character, and to ignore it is just wrong.
And The Dark Knight Rises does ignore that origin by failing to account for it in Batman’s decision to give up the cape and cowl. As a result the story doesn’t resolve all of the issues underlying Bruce Wayne’s decision to become Batman. Yes it explores what might happen if Bruce Wayne retired or passed the duties of Gotham’s protector on to someone else, and rather emotively offers him the revelation that anyone could be Batman, but that still doesn’t explain how he can so easily forget his own history.
What about Bruce Wayne’s inherent need to right wrongs and to protect the innocent from evil, as developed by the death of his parents? The script is very careful to distract from that emotional link between Bruce Wayne and Batman by replacing the death of his parents with Wayne’s desire not to emotionally devastate Alfred, but are the feelings of an old man really enough in that context? Not for me, they’re not.
Not only that, the end of the film asks us to accept that Bruce Wayne would happily turn a blind eye to the devastated Gotham, as well presumably as his inherent protective instincts, because he recognises those same instincts in John Blake and believes that the symbolic presence of the Batman in Gotham will be enough to keep it from splitting at the seams again.
First problem – that’s John Blake who has only police department training and minimal experience to go with his keys to the Batcave and a compelling backstory. And secondly, the assumption that everything will be fine as long as there’s someone there to watch over them, no matter who they are seems like an awfully un-Batman-like thing to accept, even in Nolan’s universe.
That’s not the Batman I know and love. It just isn’t.
So, how do I think it should have ended? Well, in short, Batman should have died. Because the only way Bruce Wayne would ever turn his back on his duty to Gotham – especially one completely destroyed and still suffering from the underlying problems that made Bane’s rabble-rousing work so well – would be death or debilitation.
With Bruce Wayne dead, we wouldn’t have to question how he so easily forgot the reason he became Batman, well before the reasons he continued being Batman even cropped up. And we wouldn’t be left with the preposterous suggestion that all Bruce Wayne needed to get over the ghosts of his traumatic past was the right woman and a clean slate.
What do you think? Should Batman have died? Were you happy with the final shots of the film? Or do you wish Nolan had left that answer as unanswered as the spinning top question at the end of Inception? Let us know via our handy poll below:
And now that’s over and done with you can click Next to go through my 12-point Spoilers and Secrets review, exploring all of the major story-telling decisions in depth.
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54 Comments
I felt slightly cheated that we saw him clearly at the cafe. I would have loved an Inception style, ‘is that him?’ moment. The true ending, i feel, was when Bane broke him. The Bruce Wayne who rose from that prison was a different man, thus making a different Batman. The motivations changed for him, these were more in line with Blakes views – that Gotham needs protection, not vengence. To this end, i felt that using Blake as the new hope made sense. But i agree that this might not have been the best possible resolution for the series. Came damn close, though.
Another reason it didnt hit quite were it should, was because we thought we saw the ending coming early in the film. Knowing Nolan, the minute Alfred mentioned the cafe i could see that coming a mile off. I had anticipated lose ends and ambiguity, but was met with complete resolution and hints at a spin-off.
I felt let down. The way they played out that cafe scene was for the mainstream moviegoer, who like their movie endings nice and predictable.
That moment should have ended with Alfred’s smiling into the camera, then cut to the ending scene with Blake rising up into the Batcave.
When the camera was directly on Alfred’s face, and then Alfred smiles knowingly, I thought the scene was going to end (and perhaps the movie itself). But no, it was not to be, and I was disappointed.
Why did they have to show Bruce Wayne and Selina (or any woman for that matter)?
Given the whole cafe sequence shown earlier in the movie, we already know what Alfred is seeing. The moment was powerful… and then quickly undercut.
There is something to understand here.
Nolan’s Batman is dead, Batman is not dead.
Nolan wants Batman to die in the film, because as it’s said its the reasonable ending. But thats the deal; Batman cannot die, Nolan cannot make Batman die because Nolan has to be faithfull with the comics.
Thats why the ending is strange, because Nolan wants batman to die to end his story, but cannot make him die for the comics.
I think the ending was great. I think Nolan will be back for another series. and Robin Blake WILL be Batman for the next film as it begins but Wayne will return and Robin will be getting his own “gear” by the one and only Lucius Fox. The only thing that i didnt like was that catwoman rescued batman from bane. i wanted to see batman destroy Bane. Great movie and cant wait for the next one…IN NOLAN WE TRUST
for me its inception all over again the ending can be interpreted 2 ways . since Alfred said that it was a fantasy of his to see him married with children in a cafe .that was what he ultimately what he saw. what i thought was a puss out was blake they should have had the woman who called him robin instead call him richard grayson or timothy drake
I loved the ending. I think we have seen him go through enough, most notably in this film that we are happy to see he has found peace.
For him to be enjoying he’s life again is the perfect ending. Its often been said that Alfred is our voice in the film, again this is what Alfred wanted for Bruce. I think if we watched the film right it was what we should of wanted as well and i certainly did.
It was great.
I completely agree with you! Im a huge comic book fan but my favorite comics have always been batman. Only because almost all the characters are just like us, they’re no different and it’s inspiration that we can all be heroes and that I don’t need to be able to fly or shoot fire to be one. With that said I understand where all the dedicated comic book fans are coming from. ( that it didn’t follow the comics) yes that it a bit upsetting but Nolan’s interpretation of batman is just as good as the comics. Yes to me the movie was predictable since the first cafe scene, and I knew Miranda was talia and the Blake was taking over the mantle of batman or using batmans heir and staying with his name robin. But to people who don’t read like us comic book people the endings were probably so much more exciting because it was a more element of surprise for them. And let’s be honest with eachother how many of these younger generations actuavlly read comics not much. (I am not saying all of you teens don’t read ie. I am only 20 and I read them) Like some of you had said he has gone through so much and so all I wanted for the dark knight rises ending was for batman to be happy. And that’s how ended therefore I’m satisfied. Do I truly want batman to retire? Of course not! To me he’s the only batman. Nolan has done a great job with these films and I’m not going to go hard on him for not following the comics he’s giving all of us a worth watching batman films and you can’t please everyone.
On another note my favorite part of te movie is def. the scarecrow scenes cause it was nice to being him in and remember that all those locked up in the asylum have been freed too.
Anne hathaway played her role perfect and Nolan wrote the role perfect too. Probably one of the closet things to the comics (in this movie) Selina Kyle is constantly switching back in forth from villain to “hero”
A huge complaint I have of the movie is the deaths of talia bane and foley? Talia was just pathetic especially coming from a rising actress who has had quite credible roles by now. And bane just gets blown off like nothing. He lost his whole big bad bane and inferiority just dropped way too low towards the end. And foleys death was just as horrible, all this character build up for what? One second he’s alive the other he’s dead, it wasn’t even heroic or admirable one bit.
And for all those saying that Blake isn’t robin let’s be real here, why would they bother with the whole legal name scene if he’s not actually robin. He’s robin get over it! Now will he want to use his name robin or Just become the new batman well that’s his choice and left for us to wonder.
Those were my only complaints so in the end though great movie! Thanks Christopher Nolan!
I feel they should have kept it going..they introduced robin and there’s no way you can just ignore that after the fact…balance can never give up being Batman and neither could catwoman..she’s a thef she can’t just move on and live normally..
I felt as though it was a fitting way to Nolans batman, in the scene with Alfred and Bruce , Alfred talks about Bane and how he apparently managed to escape this ancient prison. I believe he says “but sometimes a man rises from the darkness” , this is where the whole story makes sense this quote is not about the rumor of Bane climbing out of this prison. It is in fact Bruce Wayne rising from the darkness, Bruce Wayne has some what of death wish, In many ways the only way he believes he can escape the pain of his parents death, is by dying himself. But while Bruce is in the prison the old man tells him that because he doesn’t fear death it makes him weaker, he needs to care about living, and thus he rises out of the prison and out of his darkness,when he climbs out of the prison. He has the will to live again, not as batman but as Bruce Wayne. So the final scene is showing us that he has moved on, he rose from the darkness of batman and the pain of his parents death. This movie is definitively about Bruce Wayne leaving batman be hide escaping the monster. Rachel Dawes explains it too in both films, she says Bruce Waynes real face is the on that criminals now fear, the man she loved never came back. In the Dark Knight Rachel writes a letter saying , she believes that Bruce Wayne will always need batman. Finally at the end of the Dark knight rises Bruce no longer needs Batman. Gotham has also been saved effectively because batman has become an Ideal, we see this with the statue of the Dark Knight. The ending may not be perfect, but i dont think there is such a thing. This truly is a great ending, some ppl will disagree , however this a movie with one ending , and Nolan cant make everyone happy. What he has successfully done is make everything come full circle. Legend.
Well written – I pretty much agree with your thoughts on the story and how it ended.
That is a fantastic way to put it Keenen.
Agreed. I said the same thing to my brother, the ending suppose to be Inception-like. FYI, I saw Batman twice. The first day itself and also yesterday. Ahhaaaa.. I prefer The Dark Knight.
Blake isn’t Robin. He couldn’t be. The moment where he enters the cave and is circled by the bats is identical to when Wayne done it. The robin thing was just an easter egg! It was a great ending but maybe it would have been better if you just saw alfred’s face nodding into the distance – maybe a little smile!
I completely agree. It’s slightly annoying that people keep on thinking that just because his real first name is Robin that he’s going to be the “boy wonder” Robin.
No, the way it’s rolled out (as pointed to in the very first film, when Bruce Wayne talks about how a man is simply flesh and blood who can be ignored or killed, but a symbol is everlasting), Blake is going to be the next Batman.
Bruce inspired him to be something more, to get rid of his badge and pick up the “everlasting symbol.” He’s much better than an overweight cop wearing hockey pads.
And that scene at the cafe was somewhat of a letdown. Like you said, it should have just ended with Alfred looking into the camera and smiling. I didn’t need to see what he was looking at. I already knew — his eyes and his smile told me — and that was enough. Let my imagination fill in the rest.
I didn’t say Blake was going to be Robin?
Hey Simon, no one said you did?
Maybe he was just saying he hates how most people say that.
No need to be narcissistic.
You know what really grinds my gears..the same people who are criticising the ending for it being so straightforward and to the point would equally be on here b*tching if nolan did leave the end a mystery ala inception..I mean get over it and love the movie for what it is..which in my opinion is a CLASSIC ending to this trilogy and kudos for wayne living happily ever after!
It should’ve ended with a shot of Alfred’s sudden grinning face. Like at the end of City Lights or Manhattan.
I think everyone is forgetting that batman is a human being. Human beings all have stages in their life, and being batman was a stage in Bruce Wayne’s life. He did all that was necessary, he achieved all he wanted to achieve and then some. Nolan’s version of batman has always been about making it as close to real life and current events as possible. Think about it, if you were bruce wayne and experienced all that you did in the three movies, would you continue being the batman? Or would you leave the role to a friend (a younger fellah) who you knew was capable? Remember batman is not a superhuman like spiderman, wolverine, or superman. It’s easier for him to leave the job with a good reason to do so and it makes sense.
@Larry, you are exactly right! I loved the film and the ending. This is hands down one of the best movie trilogies. No matter how it ended, some fanboys are going to complain. If Bruce died, then people would’ve said that you can’t kill batman. Which I kind of preferred, batman giving his life for Gotham. But the twist was good, and I agree that John Blake was going to be the next batman, not robin. Last year in the comics, Dick Grayson was batman for awhile. To the author, if you woulve listened to any of nolans interviews, then we wouldn’t have this pointless article. Nolan said that these batman movies are not like the comics, where batman has a never ending career. Movies have to have an end, and I thought it was great. I do not understand how you don’t get that. In the film, Bruce was past his prime, and found somebody to pass the torch to. This isn’t a comic book, where Bruce fights the joker on Tuesday and the black mask on Wednesday
I listened to Nolan’s comments. And I stand by the fact that he ignored the need to address the death of Bruce Wayne’s parents as the underlying reason for him being Batman. You can call me a “fanboy” all you want – which by the way is the most inane comment possible – but please don’t presume that I am ignorant because you have a different opinion to me.
Everyone’s comments are great and I agree with each and everyone. However, are we forgetting that the basis of the whole movie is that is a comic book movie? Based on comics; batman, or Bruce Wayne, never gives up the fight. Not even to hand over the mantel if you will. Blake’s character was great, except he didn’t exist. His name should have been Grayson and that’s it. As to Bruce having a happily ever after…being with catwoman at that cafe is not even close. His happily ever after should be a damn batman at every corner of Gotham. There are so many villains that have not been accounted for that rise up to try to take over the city. Wayne knows there is so much evil out there that he would never give up the fight. For him, the fight will always continue; thus batman beyond and such. Not to mention the whole damn bat family. Also, aren’t there rumors about a Justice League movie?
Think people need to remember, this is an adaptation. By Nolan. A realistic, credible, borderline believable adaptation. So for me, Bruce Wayne’s motivations are just damn fine. I wouldn’t have changed anything about the ending. I believe Nolan didn’t need to include the shot of Bruce at the end, but he did it purposely so there would be no dangling threads – he has said, clearly and loudly on several occasions, this is the end. He wanted to be definitive. And I’m glad he was.
One thing people are forgetting this isnt the Batman from the Comics this is someone else take on batman. I know how you feel about batman leaving and living a normal life. I dont see him doing it either but if he did this is the way I see him doing it. He wouldnt leave Gotham with out an protector, and he would leave with Catwoman too lol.
Everyone needs to take a chill pill and calm down a little bit. We see a crap movie people pick holes at it. We see a great movie people will still look for holes to pick. Is it in our nature as movie lovers and “arm chair directors” to find all the inconsistencies possible just to seek some self gratification of spotting something everyone else missed?
I felt it was pretty flawless. And tied everything perfectly well based on what Nolans vission was for “This” batman franchise. And Not what happened in the Comic books as I feel they are loosely based on the comic book events but not follow them as gossbal. Yes you could ague the movie seemed to feel slow at the first/middle half of the movie but what do you expect when you have to explain what’s happend between the 7year gap between TDK & TDKR.
In regards to Alfred’s Cafe Scene, I would have just made Alfred tell Bruce about when he goes there without actually showing the audience at all. So we only see it at the end when Alfred is actually there.
The fact we see bruce at the cafe alive and well is irrelivent in my opinion. It still worked.
Lastly we are going to be back here again in Dec talking about how the Hobbit should have ended.
See you then
I think it should have ended more similar to Dark Knight Returns where he faked his death with Superman just replace superman for bane and make it a real death. Batman Can’t have a happy ending its not true to the character the mission or the reality of such a pathology. Someone who is used to avenging evildoers and jumping off roof tops could not make it as a normal person. It would have been better if Bruce died and the legend of batman carried on. So in the coffee shop Alfred should have seen some homage to batman (yes in Italy) and realized that Bruce was right all along and he did not fail Bruce. That Bruce died with his parents and that The Batman Turned this Gothic tragedy into a victory. Batman is an idea a symbol catalyzed by the man who was Bruce. No one should have taken over just the idea should have spread world wide as a symbol of justice. Kind of like an Übermensch
or John Galt in atlas shrugged or Robbin Hood or so on.
I think it should have ended more similar to Dark Knight Returns where he faked his death with Superman just replace superman for bane and make it a real death. Batman Can’t have a happy ending its not true to the character the mission or the reality of such a pathology. Someone who is used to avenging evildoers and jumping off roof tops could not make it as a normal person. It would have been better if Bruce died and the legend of batman carried on. So in the coffee shop Alfred should have seen some homage to batman (yes in Italy) and realized that Bruce was right all along and he did not fail Bruce. That Bruce died with his parents and that The Batman Turned this Gothic tragedy into a victory. Batman is an idea a symbol catalyzed by the man who was Bruce. No one should have taken over just the idea should have spread world wide as a symbol of justice. Kind of like an Übermensch
or John Galt in atlas shrugged or Robbin Hood or so on.
The ending was crap because Batman does not quit. It falls apart for me because anyone who truly understands this character knows, Bruce Wayne is the mask, NOT Batman. I thought even Nolan himself understood that. He hinted as much in the first two movies by portraying Batman as being forced to pretend to be the playboy type, when he’d really rather be punching some drug pusher in the face.
Frankly, Batman is a psychopath. His need to fight crime is a sickness, an uncontrollable compulsion, one that defines his whole being. Suggesting he can merely walk away from being Batman is like suggesting someone terminally ill can simply decide to not have their illness anymore. This movie takes it a step further, suggesting being Batman is something he wants desperately to escape from, when nothing could be further from the truth. Knowing that, there’s no way you can accept this B.S. “they all lived happily ever after” crap. Batman would be tossing and turning every night, thinking about all the criminal scum getting away with rapes, muggings and murders even as he sleeps beneath satin sheets. And settling down with Selina Kyle no less. Don’t make me freakin’ laugh. Oh, so she’s completely abandoned her nature too, just gave up being a klepto.
Frankly I think the studio interfered with Nolan’s vision. His original plan probably *WAS* for Batman to die but he’s still working on a licensed character and DC has plenty of underoos and Batman happy meals to sell so the studio probably muddied up everything. He learned what comic creators have already known for awhile now, Work for Hire is a b–ch. Just ask the guy who *really* created Batman, giving him his origin and all the things that really made his character– Bob Kane from what I understand really only did the character design– and who (along with his estate) hasn’t seen a penny of royalties.
What frustrated me the most was that Nolan kept hinting at the perfect ending then completely missed his opportunity!
The whole point of the last movie was that Batman wasn’t a hero, he was meant to be a guardian and a protector of Gotham. His true power was his anonymity as he could be vilified without consequence.
Now, in TDKR, it’s noted that an orphanage is suffering because Wayne Enterprises is no longer contributing any funds and later, Selina Kyle makes reference to to Bruce Wayne and “the rest of us”. Essentially, Nolan is establishing that not only is Batman considered an enemy of Gotham, but in a way so is Bruce Wayne.
Later on in the movie, Alfred even points out (sorry, can’t remember the exact quote) that Gotham needs Bruce Wayne.
So as I see it, the movie should have ended with the Batman ‘character’ dying. How? Not sure, but some level of sacrifice was required (I thought the whole nuke thing was very clichéd). This would obviously result in the redemption of the Batman.
Bruce Wayne, freed of Batman, could then step forward and start using his wealth and influence to help Gotham’s underprivileged, thus becoming a hero in his own right. A hero without a mask, like Harvey Dent and like his father.
I agree, Simon. I saw the movie earlier today, and I felt rather let down by the ending. It was the same kind of feeling I had in “Batman Begins,” when Batman told Ra’s al Ghul that although he wouldn’t kill him, he didn’t have to save him. Um, yes, you do…you’re Batman. There is no villain that he wouldn’t snatch from danger, no matter how little they deserved his help.
As you said, it’s up to Nolan to play with the history of the character in order to make the movie work. But this aspect of Batman’s personality – the relentless commitment to his mission that makes him feel entitled to play both judge and jury, if not executioner – has been pretty consistent through all the different interpretations of the character. It doesn’t seem true to the spirit of Batman, to contradict it so completely.
I think the movie ended perfectly. The way I see it, Bruce sacrificed living the rest of his life as Batman in order to set up Batman as a legendary figure. I think the theme of identify/reputation runs throughout all three movies.
In Batman Begins, Bruce learns from Ra’s that “You must become more than just a man in the mind of your opponent.”
Also, the following exchange I think plants the seed for the end of the trilogy:
Ducard/Ra’s: “A vigilante is just a man lost in the scramble for his own gratification. He can be destroyed, or locked up. But if you make yourself more than just a man, if you devote yourself to an ideal, and if they can’t stop you, then you become something else entirely.”
Bruce: “Which is?”
Ducard/Ra’s: “A legend, Mr Wayne.”
I think this is reinforced in TDKR, as Ra’s (or, I should say, the figment of Ra’s which appears in Bruce’s mind) states something along the lines of (paraphrasing): “There’s more than one way to become immortal.” I think the ending of the trilogy ties in with Bruce sacrificing his public life (as Bruce Wayne) in order to build the legend of Batman as an ‘immortal’ guardian, who can seemingly defy death. Now, he could have just escaped and carried on his role as Wayne/Batman, but as pointed out earlier, a man can “be destroyed, or locked up.” I think the fact that Bruce has set up John Blake to carry on as Batman (which was the interpretation I left with, rather than as Nightwing or Robin), shows that Bruce intends the figure of Batman to carry on without him. Bruce knows that as an individual man, Batman is mortal, but as a symbol (which can be picked up by a series of successors) Batman could be become an induring figure who could live on through the years – there is indeed, more than one way to become immortal.
I also think that the ending of TDK, and the impact that Dent’s reputation has on Gotham, reinforces this idea. As a man, Dent was only human – he succumbed to evil at the end of the second movie. But as a symbol, thanks to Batman’s sacrifice, his legacy was the Dent Act, which essentially resulted in a period of 8 years relative peace in Gotham. I think this probably served to highlight to Bruce that, the symbol of Batman could achieve more than Bruce himself running around beating up bad guys ever could.
Now, they could have gone another route and killed off Bruce for real, and still leave us with the possibility of Blake becoming Batman – but come on, who doesn’t want the hero to retire to a life of peace and happiness? If you remember the first film, when Ra’s is training Bruce, he says to Bruce “Your anger gives you great power. But if you let it, it will destroy you. As it almost did me.” Of course, it eventually did leave to Ra’s death. In TDKR, when Bruce is in the pit, the Dr questions him about his fear – to which he responds, “I’m not afraid – I’m angry.” I think Bruce actually sacrificing his life would have meant he had given in to his anger – but choosing to give up the Batman persona, and living his own life, he has overcome the anger which initially set him on the path to becoming Batman.
*phew* – that took longer than I had anticipated!
“Because the only way Bruce Wayne would ever turn his back on his duty to Gotham – especially one completely destroyed and still suffering from the underlying problems that made Bane’s rabble-rousing work so well – would be death or debilitation.”
But he turned his back on Gotham for EIGHT YEARS according to this stupid movie. Because of MAGGIE GYLLENHAAL, no less.
HA HA HA HA HA
I think the best ending would have been to have Rachael be the woman with Bruce at the end. Then it would truly leave it open ended. Did Bruce die? Is Rachael dead? Is Bruce dead because Alfred sees him with Rachael?
Rachael died in TDK lol. when the building blows up as Batman runs in to save Dent, remember?
I believe that the movie was amazing. Nothing about it was bad. Banes protrail was spot on and cat woman was not a gimmick I thought it would be. Nolans twist on Batman is HIS twist on Batman. A realist, somewhat plausible way of telling a fantasy story. Passin the touch leaves Gotham with a Batman, just not Bruce Wayne. It leaves the city with hope. Bruce Waynes city. And you can walk away from it. People who work a job 25 years, eventually have to walk away from their passion because the body just cant take it anymore. Look at it as a cop retiring. Yes the physical person is gone but leaves his badge for someone else to protect the streets. Now with that said. I would have been happy that the movie showd all the tie ins then showed Alfred smiling at the camera and fade to black. But I am fine with seeing Bruce at the end. Because he has had such a hard journey and knowing he has passed the “badge” on to someone else he cant rest assured Gotham will be okay.
you do realise that comic book lore is never a done deal. Batman stepping aside leaves a space for Robin to fill, even if temporarily. In practical terms, they get to decide whether to continue the franchise with or without Bale/Batman. It makes sense.
Loved the movie but I think Bruce should not have faked his death at the end. I think he should have stayed in Gotham, took back Wayne Enterprises and built it back into a success full company all the while training Blake to be Batman. I like the Blake but he needs a lot more work before he goes out to fight crime as The Batman. Bruce would also have to apologize to Alfred and hire him back. Oh, and get a decorator for the mansion, that place was depressing. A tomb more than a house. Maybe Selina could help. :)
Re: “I would like to round up all the posters on this thread, and the people who run this ridiculous site, put you in a bag, and drop you in a river.”
You do realize you are also a poster on this site right?
I think it works just fine. Wayne is done as Batman. Does no harm to just show him being happy for a moment.
I mean if ambiguity is intrinsically valuable in this case, then I would suggest that the cafe scene was just Alfred’s dream anyway, and who’s to say it wasn’t. Basically, Wayne died in the nuke blast. Right?
Here’s how it should have ended:
ALFRED dies and Batman (Bruce Wayne) is crippled and disabled for life in his fight with Bane and becomes John Blake’s mentor and teacher in the continuing franchise of Batman.
After leaving the theater, I felt a bit underwhelmed. I liked the movie, but I didn’t love it. It seemed like Christopher Nolan actually underplayed the moments that were supposed to be very emotional and epic (the final battle with Bane). I think Bruce Wayne should have died, as it would make more sense then him just quitting so he could make whoopie with Selina Kyle in Italy.
I loved how Nolan told a great story with this trilogy. I vividly remember the scene where Batman tells Blake that he needs to wear a mask. Blake replies that he wants people to know who he is and Batman replies that the mask protects the ones he loves……Alfred wanting Bruce to live and become whole with a family…..Nice.
The ending worked perfectly for me. Nolan did something that most writers couldn’t do: allow Bruce to grow. In the grounded reality of this trilogy’s Batman, Bruce couldn’t continue to be Batman forever. The physical toll is simply too much. He saved Gotham and he, deservedly, moved on.
Colin, I agree with everything you said. I was sitting there in shock for a few minutes because I really thought it was going to end with Bruce dying. I agree with what a few people said about main stream movie goers not being able to handle that. I said that exact thing to my girlfriend when we were leaving the theatre. I think it was a good way to end the movie. I think an Inception-like ending where Alfred looks over and sees the back of a head that looks like Bruce’s before moving on to the Blake/Batcave scene would have been cool too.
I think it was perfect, Alfred wanted him to stop being Batman because it was time for someone else to cntinue the legacy. At the beginning Alfred warned Bruce to not go and that he would be devastated if he died. I think Bruce stopped being Batman for Alfred and because he knew he was right and it was time to move on and start a new life. That is also why he left the bag for John Blake with he rope and everything necessary to find the Batcave at the end it looks like Blake was going up to find the Batman suit and learn everything he needs to learn, but I also think that Batman should have finished Bane or maybe he isnt finished….
Great Movie I love Batman and I think Blake would be great in asuming the role of The Dark Knight
This is how Batman should have ended. Bane defeated, Gotham back to normal etc etc. Credits roll. Then after the credits a scene with Bruce Wayne walking into a circus tent we see a sign for the flying Graysons. Wayne sits in his box seats possibly with Selina Kyle. They introduce the flying Graysons we see the acrobats perform then all of the sudden gun shots are heard cut to black end of trilogy.
I just wanted to address one issue that people keep bringing up, “It’s stupid the people of Gotham dont realise that Batman is Bruce Wayne when they both happen to die at the same time.”
1. The only people attending his funeral seem to be those that knew Batman and Bruce were one and the same.
2. Even in a realistic interpretation of A DC universe, when compared to the fact that nobody realises Superman and Clark Kent have the same face, it’s fair to say a li’l lee way is alright.
3. Bruce Wayne was missing and presumed dead in Batman Begins, and returned to everyone’s surprise. In The Dark Knight Rises he has disappeared again, thought of as a mad recluse… and then returns to everyones surprise. Now I’m not knocking this trilogy, as its my favourite trilogy of all time, But even if Bruce Wayne was reported to be dead again the papers probably wouldn’t even run the headline as it’s such old hat by now anyway.
Issue cleared up?
He didn’t leave because he assumed JGL had his back. He left because Gotham didn’t need him anymore. They found the symbol of the dark protector to rally behind, and the cops became selfless heros that would carry on the tradition as righteous protectors of the city. The story arc of Matthew Modine’s character represented that. In BB, Wayne said it would be a temporary situation. He would create this mythic symbol that would fix gotham. He kind of created that symbol with Dent’s false martyrdom, but this led to a false sense of security and failed to fix the equality issues in Gotham. After Bane’s revolution, things have been squared up between the rich and poor, everyone is united after the devastating siege and occupation, and the societal barriers that were preventing meaningful change in Gotham’s nature have been ripped away. Gotham is now able to change, and the symbol of Batman is the icon they rally behind. Mission Accomplished on B.Wayne’s part.
Can we all get past Bruce Wayne surviving? The only reason there is so much dissatisfaction with Wayne living is that everybody predicted that he was going to die.
Ironically, a lot of the people that predicted his death are now pissed at “how predictable” it was to have Bruce Wayne survive.
The perfect moment to end this movie would have been after the funeral,when Lucius discovers Bruce Had fixed the autopilot. Passing the cape and cowl to a rookie and the cafe scene completely ruined what could have been such a great ending to a trilogy.
Just one thing. Read the comic Batman : the dark knight returns by frank miller.
Thank you, for putting that point out there!!
Alfred seeing Bruce in the cafe was only his remembrance of what he wished had happened. I think Gotham will grow to know Bruce Wayne was Batman, but but remember Batman more as the ideal of The Batman will continue thru Robin Blake. Bruce Wayne died in the explosion. The auto-pilot was broken. That’s my interpretation of the ending.