Since its release a month ago, Christopher Nolan’s finale to his Batman trilogy has been the center of many heated discussions among movie lovers and Batman fans. While The Dark Knight generated near unanimous praise, The Dark Knight Rises is without a doubt a more polarizing film. Some see it as a near perfect film that satisfies in every way, while others see it as good, but dampened by apparent plot holes, a rushed plot, and motivational inconsistencies. However, one of the biggest criticisms I consistently hear about has to do with the plot twist involving Miranda Tate.
Near the end of the film, as Batman is screaming at Bane to give him the trigger to the fusion bomb, it is revealed that Miranda is actually Talia Al Ghul, daughter of Ra’s Al Ghul, and that she was the one to actually escape the prison pit, not Bane. Bane had actually been her protector; rescued by Ra’s Al Ghul and taken into the League of Shadows only to be excommunicated due to his injury. Many contend that this reveal completely destroys the villainous nature of Bane, who up until that point had been thought to be the mastermind behind the entire operation. I’ve heard people claim that it makes him simply another lackey; a pawn to be used by Talia in the same vein as Bane’s subservience to Poison Ivy in Batman & Robin.
Let me start right off the bat that any comparison to that aforementioned abomination is ridiculous. Nolan’s Bane, even if we are to presume that he is Talia’s overstuffed body guard, is nothing like the Schumacher Bane. That Bane literally had the mental capacity of an obedient toddler. He could barely speak, and when he did, it was only his name. Nolan’s Bane is strong, intelligent, calculating, and a charismatic public speaker.
Again though, this is assuming Bane is merely Talia’s lackey, which is what many people believe to be the case. However, I simply do not see where this is coming from. Make no mistake, Talia’s reveal does change the viewer’s perspective of Bane. It gives us a little more insight into his motivation, which until that point was to lead the League of Shadows to “fulfill Ra’s Al Ghul’s destiny.” Now we come to find out that Bane is not the actual leader of the League of Shadows, Talia is. We also learn of Talia’s motivation, which is not only to finish her father’s work by destroying Gotham, but to also avenge his death by killing Bruce Wayne (and herself apparently).
I have yet to hear a legitimate reason why this sudden revelation negates all the work Bane did in the last 2 hours. We saw him hijack a CIA plane, work covertly with and manipulate Daggett Industries, attack the Gotham Stock Exchange, bankrupt Wayne Enterprises, lead and manage an underground army to strategically wire the entire city with explosives, orchestrate and further manipulate the people of Gotham into a revolution, and hold the city hostage for months. As far as I know, Talia was not directly involved with this. Yes, I’m sure the plan was formulated and outlined by Talia, perhaps even with Bane’s input, but it was Bane himself who managed the operation while she played the part of Miranda Tate in order to wiggle her way into both the CEO seat of Wayne Enterprises and Bruce’s heart. Basically, the two worked together. To me, this looks to be more of a partnership than a straight up dominant/subordinate relationship others seem to pick up on. Just because we find out that he is #2 instead of #1 doesn’t mean the guy isn’t highly intelligent and strong. He’d have to be in order to do the things he did in the film, and Talia’s entire scheme would have been impossible to achieve without him.
There are two particular instances in the film that further demonstrate that Bane is not just Talia’s subordinate. While Batman and Bane are fighting for the first time in the sewers, Bane exclaims, “I am the League of Shadows!” One may argue that this is just simple boasting on Bane’s part, but to me this further exemplifies Bane’s dual motivations. We know that he loves Talia, and will protect her with his life, but a man who operates on love alone does not boast in such a way. Clearly he thinks of himself as the leader, despite that fact that he is not. Maybe he is right to think this way. After all, he was doing more of the work than Talia was.
Bane’s final scene is another example that leads me to believe there is more motivating Bane than his love for Talia. After she tells him to keep Bruce alive, Bane proceeds to disobey this direct order, stating that, “We both know I have to kill you now.” Why would a person who supposedly exists only to obey Talia’s orders go on to contradict them in the very next scene? Again, Bane appears to have more motivation than that. Perhaps his pride was broken when Batman defeated him, and he couldn’t allow someone stronger than himself live. Maybe when Talia isn’t around, Bane thinks of himself as in control. Admittedly, we don’t know enough about Bane’s motivations to know for sure, but the simple fact that he disobeyed the person he loves shows that love isn’t his sole motivation.
As much as I enjoy The Dark Knight Rises, even I admit that there are many legitimate problems with the film. While watching it, you get the sense that the Brothers Nolan had so many ideas they wanted to explore that none of them get properly explored. Long stretches of time pass by within single scenes, which can be startling upon first viewings. And despite all the innovation and thematically rich story developments, the conclusion is predicated upon a cliché ticking time bomb. Despite my defending of the end twist in relation to the character of Bane, Nolan’s Talia is pretty shallow compared to her comic book counterpart. However, I disagree with the idea that Talia’s reveal somehow negates Bane’s impact. Whether he was the actual leader of the League of Shadows or not, he was still the physical architect of the death and destruction that befell Gotham City for months, and he did it with the proper cold and calculating menace expected of the character. Nolan’s Bane, as played brilliantly by Tom Hardy, was a magnificent villain, which ever way you look at him.
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23 Comments
Solid write up and much better and considered than the article that argued the opposite. Two points. Talia being more shallow than her comic book counterpart is a bit of a stretch. Over the forty plus years she has appeared, her characterization has varied considerably, and it is disingenuous to think there is one ‘definitive’ version. Nolan simply took facets of the character that worked for the film’s story. Second: In terms of motivations being sketchy, is that true. If Ra’s was successful in BB, he would of still blown himself up. The fact of the matter is the League is a bunch of fundamentalists willing to pay the ultimate price for their beliefs.
Lastly, the ticking time clock being cliche…I guess so, but how else would it be possible to visually cue the audience in to the amount of time left prior to it blowing up. I see what you mean, but think this a necessary evil more than anything.
Thank you for your comment Dan.
I consider Nolan’s Talia a bit shallow because it totally missed out on the compelling relationship between Bruce and Talia, specifically the conflict between her loyalty to her father and her love for Bruce. I can’t help but feel that had she been introduced in Batman Begins, her character and her impact would have been far greater. But I can’t blame Nolan for this missed opportunity, he didn’t plan that far ahead.
As for Ra’s motivation, I’m pretty sure Ra’s never intended to kill himself during his fear gas attack on Gotham. Talia apparently wanted to die with Gotham, where as I never got that sense with Ra’s.
@bandon jacobs. Did u miss the part where Ras al ghul says “my fate lies with the people of gotham” in begins.
ilrood, that doesn’t mean he meant to die. I always took it that he meant his fate was to restore the balance via the fear gas. Once the train hit the main hub, it was going to create a chain reaction and evaporate the entire water supply. It is never stated there would be an explosion, nor was it implied he would die. The League wouldn’t be very good at their job if their leaders were expected to die during every purge of a major city or nation.
The definition of fate is the way in which you die.
Cool man. Being a fan of the character I can appreciate that; however, the films aren’t the comics and I was readily able to accept the liberties Nolan took with the character. Speaking with a number of friends who where unfamiliar with Talia prior to the film, they all liked the twist and the character-especially after seeing the film a second time and noticing all the subtle things Cotillard did with her prior to the reveal. It is just important to remember that the majority of the movie going public has no idea who Talia is, and Nolan was making the film for them as much as those familiar with the lore of the character. As such, the essence of the character is there (loyalty to her father following his death despite being previously estranged) but differences have to be accepted.
Lastly, in BB Ra’s states that his fate lies with the rest of Gotham, and it was known that an explosion would occur if he got to Wayne Tower. Could he have escaped? Maybe, but I thought he was pretty fatalistic. The question arises, would his death have bothered Talia if he ultimately was going to die? I think so because the League failed in their ultimate goal, and one person was responsible for this-Batman.
I had a different take on the entire thing, which like you exonerates Bane from being a lackey. The League of Shadows has no head, similar to the idea that Batman is not one person, anyone can be him. I thought this because while Bruce was in prison having his “conversation” with Ra’s Al Gul, I thought that the point of Ra’s saying he was immortal was that even if Batman killed him “the head” it did not matter. Someone would take his place and the league would continue on with or without him. What “leads” them is an ideal not a person and therefore no one person is its real head. But sure, Bane is the mastermind behind everything and he often kills his own henchman whenever they failed on a job. But I would argue that those henchman were not members of the league of shadows (especially considering they did not seem to have the fighting skills of Bane or Batman) but brainwashed followers of that ideal. There it is a leadership “structure” but the fact that the organization continues to exist and operate (even continuing on their original plan to destroy Gotham) shows that the loss of their presumed leader was almost meaningless thus making them more dangerous. When Bane proclaims he is the League of Shadows, he can rightly do so if what he means is that he like all of its parts, embodies what the League of Shadows really is – an ideal.
Thanks for the comment, interesting take. I agree with much of what you said, especially since we know Ra’s isn’t actually immortal in the Nolan films, no doubt the League has been lead by different individuals in the past.
Thanks for this article, you wrote exactly what I thought while reading the “opposite” article. Bane essentially saying ‘screw you Talia, I’m gonna finish Wayne myself’ is a very important clue to Bane’s autonomous thinking.
One thing I was wondering and discussing with a friend is this: Talia and Bane know the full extent pf their plan and seem to explicitely have enough motivation to accept dying in the execution of it. But what about the rest? For instance, is Deadshot (as I now call Barsad) up for this? It seems Bane does little to conceal that he will in fact blow Gotham sky high no matter what. How many mercenaries would not take note of this possibility yet still simply cooperate? It seems risky on Bane’s part to assume or otherwise somewhat of a stretch in believability that all these men, whom a lot of seem to be, unlike what some people think, no true LoS members but just mercenaries, to actually willingly go down with Gotham…
There is nowhere that says that it was all Talia. And in fact there is nothing that says that was the real league of shadows. Anything could be changed. Talia could be the leader of a new league of shadows and wanted to destroy Gotham and it could have been Bane that planned everything. Nowhere does it say that he didn’t do everything. He is the strategist remember? She could be like any CEO who has the idea but gets other guys to do it and think it for them. Ie Talia says she wants to destroy Gotham and Bane knows how to do it. Also he was not excommunicated cos of his injury(where did it say that in the film). And Talia probably wanted to die because she’s crazy.
In the screenplay Bane reveals to Batman when he is beaten that he wants to fulfill “Ra’s al Ghul’s destiny” because Ra’s al Ghul saved him from the pit, like a thank you.
It could also be argued that only Talia and Bane were the only LOS members, the rest were mercenaries brainwashed or actually thinking Bane wanted a real revolution and Bane using them (ends justify the means).
If there was another movie they could easily explain differences like the fact, why do they want to destroy Gotham when its not that bad anymore? Easy. They’re crazy. fanatical.
If by well played by Tom Hardy you Hardy did Darryl Hammond doing Sean Connery in a silly lisping sing song then you would be correct. It really sunk in while I sat there listening to his fifteen minute long speech at the football stadium that this was a deeply flawed and outrageously silly film. And there was still over an hour left. “I’ll take the rapists for a hundred Trebek…I mean batma.”
Here’s a good question too: if you’re going to make bane strong enough to punch through solid walls, why not make him on steroids? That’s way more believable then painkillers making you able to punch through rock. It’s because Nolan is an ersatz intellectual who thought painkillers would be more realistic like how Hathaway not being called catwoman is somehow realistic even though none of it makes a difference because the film is silly enough to have batman miracled out of a cockpit before a nuke goes off by…I don’t know Jesus or someone.
When is it said that the painkillers are what makes Bane strong?
Bane, with his scenes at the football stadium and on the steps of city hall, is Theatricality. Talia, playing the part of Miranda Tate, is Deception. Working together, these two define the League of Shadows, and thus, are essential to one another.
The fact that this film works on so many levels is one of the reasons I love it.
Wow I personally never thought of it that way (theatricality and deception)… that’s great!
Very well stated… I realize the movie isn’t a mini-series. Perhaps it should have been a 2-parter(Hollywood studios love that). But I would love for there to have been an extended scene in the board room when Talia actually took over Wayne Enterprises… some strong dialog from her in that meeting would have given some extra weight to the character.
Completely agreed with you…but i believe,one small change could have changed the way people think of Bane.During Talia’s revelation,it should have been Bane who tells her backstory,not Talia alone.This would have given an upper hand to Bane’s character in the audience’s mind.
Nolan did a very good job with Bane, as well as Tom’s acting, and i almost believed Bane was Ra’s child with all the references to being born in the dark and was only a few moments before the twist i realised Tate’s involvement.
it was after that when the film started to fail, not cos of the twist but cos of the endless clichés that came after from Catwomans kiss to bruce still being alive.
And to top it off John Blake had to be Robin didn’t he, after both Nolan and Bale agreeing that there will never be a robin in the trilogy they just slapped it in their right at the end.
I felt a little insulted tbh
John Blake is not going to be Robin, In fact his full name was really Robin John blake.. after the event bruce pass the mantle of batman to blake…
@Benjo, well of course he’s not going to be robin cos it’s the end of Nolans trilogy, but why mention that his name was robin at the end if not to insinuate that he will become Robin, they could of said his real name was Jean-Paul cos he actually took the mantal of the bat during the Knightfall saga or just left it as John Blake because we all knew that the legend will continue even if the man could not.
but they called him Robin for no other reason then to say he will become robin.
Having his legal name be Robin is a nod to the origins.
Bane serves Talia out of love. But his own ultimate goal, his own ultimate vision is to liberate Gotham, to have the poor, the prisoners, and the underdog enjoy their city while the wealthy and greedy are tried.
That’s why in the scene where the scientist activates the fusion bomb and tells that the bomb will go off in 5 months without needing detonation, Bane gives an almost disappointed look, knowing that he must accepts the fate of the plans.
Bane doesn’t want to nuke Gotham, it was Talia who simply wanted to complete her father’s mission. Bane would have loved for “his” Gotham to continue on for years and years if he was truly the one in charge.
Good point. I could certainly see an unwritten scene where Talia says to Bane “YOU are the League of Shadows now. I am just your pawn until I give the signal/am in position/whatver.” Doesn’t ruin Bane’s character at all.
Good analysis.
I don’t know if this is related to the topic at hand here, but I just want to mention this: Talia and Bane’s relationship. Ever since I saw TDKR for the first time, I’ve always seen them as having a father-daughter or brother-sister bond rather than a romance. I don’t know, just something about their chemistry and backstories doesn’t add up to how in any way they were a couple. It just seemed more like a family thing in my opinion.